Procrastinators Anonymous is a fellowship of men and women who share their experience, strength and hope with each other that they may solve their common problem and help others to recover from chronic procrastination.
12 steps to confusion ???? AA is a Cult? what the heck?
Noticed the google ad at the top of the page about the 12 steps to confusion and aa is a cult. It struck me as interesting, so I decided to check it out. Kinda weird if you ask me. Of course I am biased, since I myself am a pretty avid "12 stepper" as the "rational recovery" site call us. The 12 steps pulled me out of my darkest hour and absolutely saved my marriage and my parents lives. Curious whether PA is responsible for those ads or whether they are randomly generated. I am thinking they are randomly generated.
Are there other 12 steppers here? I think when I was using the PA site regularly there were some. If there are, I would be interested in what you think about it.
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weird ads on site
I don't control the ads on the site - Google puts them there. Google crawls the site, sees that it's about procrastination and 12-step, and then inserts ads for people who bought the keyword "procrastination or 12-step". In some cases, those ads are weird!
Other 12-steppers here? Yes, quite a few. I'll be 10 years sober in May.
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Procrastination is the grave in which opportunity is buried.
re: weird ads
I figured they were randomly generated. That freaks me out man. I hate it that the computer knows what content I am viewing. Just weird.
I'm currently working on
I'm currently working on quitting coffee. I cut down my morning dosage to roughly half my usual amount, and I try to avoid coffee at any other time during the day. Some day, I plan to quit.
BBC just had an article about the uselessness of coffee - something that I suspected all along.
Although I'm an atheist, AA are not entirely evil in my book, even if they prey on the emotionally vulnerable and indoctrinate them (cult?) It's obviously better to be moderately religious than an alcoholic.
commenting on what you don't know about
It's pretty clear from what you wrote that you don't have any direct experience of A.A. You shouldn't pass judgement on something you don't know about. A.A. doesn't "prey" on anybody. That's ridiculous.
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Procrastination is the grave in which opportunity is buried.
re:commenting
Do it now was quoting the weird website. Not passing judgements... nice to see you again, pro!
pro, we were discussing the
pro, we were discussing the web site. Did you see "even if" in my post?
skimming
I'm glad I misunderstood.
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Procrastination is the grave in which opportunity is buried.
cutting down on coffee, also spirituality
I've managed to cut down on coffee lately by drinking a glass of water instead. Also, I've been using either "half-caf" or de-caf during the day for "normal" use. Then, whenever I have a cup or "gourmet" or "good" coffee a time or so during the the week, it tastes more special. It's odd how we so often have a cup of coffee when faced with a stressful situation in our culture.
As for spirituality and religion in 12 step programs, I've been around AA for nearly ten years. I'm not religious, and I've noticed that religion and spirituality are a bit different. Alot of people who have "religious experiences" early on in AA usually fail in quitting drinking. I can think of many who did. Not to get philosophical here--or open a major topic--but religious experiences seem to happen from choice. Spiritual experiences usually evolve over time, and (in my case, at least), tend to be a better understanding of the big picture--sort of by default. Whatever force which makes flowers grow or keeps the planets in place, whether it's a being or just some sort of sub-atomic tendency, seems to work better in the whole scheme of things than some of the ideas which pop into my head.
For procrastination, I've become aware that I get a "buzz" out of doing it--especially if it involves others. It feels great to tell a client I'm not quite finished, because I get control. That's one thing that practically put me on the skids. If there's some little hormone or whatever released then, I'm probably addicted to it, either literally or figuratively. Doing what they suggested here still goes against my grain, but it seems to work. There are alot of things I still don't understand, but I think I need to check them out. I hope this helps someone. Thanks, and take care
Re:also sprituality
Spiritual experiences usually evolve over time, and (in my case, at least), tend to be a better understanding of the big picture--sort of by default. Whatever force which makes flowers grow or keeps the planets in place, whether it's a being or just some sort of sub-atomic tendency, seems to work better in the whole scheme of things than some of the ideas which pop into my head
I agree with this. and there's nothing wrong with opening a new topic, especially an interesting one.... Some might call it controversial, but we seem to be thinking on somewhat of the same track here. before I go on though- Keep in mind the following is only an expression of my beliefs, and I'm not trying to change yours or anyone elses.. Just makes for an interesting conversation. I'm always open to toher people's ways of thinking- I might just learn something new and different.
God to me is a spritual, all knowing presence- maybe a being - i dunno- . All i know is that there's something out there that knows more than I do and if I am open and availalbe to that presence, I can function pretty well. When I abandon it for my will, things turn sour in a hurry. It sure saved my ass in the height of my dusfunction. Most of the time i do conceptualize god as a being but only because it's more tangible that way. Seemingly more accessible. I've come to understand religion more now too. Early in my recovery i couldn't handle "religion" the word God borught to mind hell and damnation. but I learned that god doesn't have to be scary, or a being. Also, I was raised with a hodge podge of different beliefs- i seem just about all of it. From strict southern baptist to buddishm (which mind you couldn't be more opposite). I had exposure to the so called "spirituality "too b/c my parents are recovering addicts, and through their recovery But over time, I have been able to translate religion into spirituality, and I find a connection with that "presence" when i attend services at our church.. I also view church as a place to find friends and support when I'm down. It works for me now.
You had mentioned you were an athiest, and I'm curious exactly how that looks for you. What i mean is do you believe that there is no God at all or just not the traditional image of God? Different people have different interpretations of the word. If you don't feel comfortable telling me, No prob. just a curiosity.
Good luck with the coffee... I'm a coffee drinker too, but it doesn't seem to be causing me any problems yet. I have my 2 cups in the morning and an occasional decaf after dinner. I tried to quit once but decided that being addicted to coffee was better than driving off the side of the road and injuring myslef and my children while taking them to school in the morning. not to mention wrecking the car...lol
Mis-directed reply
You had mentioned you were an athiest, and I'm curious exactly how that looks for you. What i mean is do you believe that there is no God at all or just not the traditional image of God? Different people have different interpretations of the word. If you don't feel comfortable telling me, No prob. just a curiosity.
I'm realizing now that I am re-reading this thread that in my reaply to Lark's post I included this which was really directed at doitnow's post. Sorry bout that.
(sorry - off-topic) atheism
No it's no problem. On the other hand, the topic is not exactly interesting to me (like debating the existence of Santa) I think I was in my late teens when, for many reasons, I realized that "God" was just a figment of human imagination.
If you'd like to debate atheists, I would suggest usenet.
If you want to watch people condemn themselves to hell, like I did above ::lol:: , youtube is the place.
Re:Atheism
Nah. I really have no desire to debate anyone about their religion or lack there of.. Like I said i'm not trying to sell my way of thought on anyone. Just if I happen to run across someone now and then, and they have a desire to discuss(not debate- cause i'm terrible at debating
) thier beliefs I'm all for it. Just cause I find it interesting how different people are. I'm a psycohlogy major and therefore always analyzing something , whether I mean to or not. lol. Thanks for the links though, if i ever do get the desire to debate, and get to be any good at it, i might check them out just for the heck of it.
No doubt
"It's obviously better to be moderately religious than an alcoholic."
No doubt there... I am a spiritual/reigious person- more spiritual than religious for sure (In my mind there is a difference.) so I have no trouble with the "God" or "power greater than ourselves part of the 12 steps. In my opinion, so long as one knows that recovery without help is pretty near impossible, so as long as one believes in something - whatever it is I say it's good. to each his own like lark said. What works for some doesn't for others.
Being biased, I don't believe that good groups "prey on the emotionally vulnerable and indoctrinate them." Ya know, just like any organization, I'm sure there are some meetings/ groups that are like that. I am not an alcoholic, so AA was never "my" meeting. I am a co-dependent/ ACOA person. I have been to some AA meeting however, b/c sometime the others are hard to come by since we live in a rural area. In comparison to some other 12 step mtgs. they do seem a little more die- hard than some of the others, however. Whatever the case though the 12 stpes have helped me and are way out of my dysfunction.
Me too.
I guess it's like different strokes for different folks. I believe that 12 step programs can only help, and have seen ALOT of folks using alternative methods not get the results they wanted. AA was the only thing in 25 years that helped me quit drinking, so perhaps I'm a bit biased! They're supposed to be working on a medicine to curb the addictiveness of alcohol, but would it keep one from acting nuts when they drink? Gee I think I'll stick with what I have. As for PA, there doesn't seem to be much 12 step-working here, and although it's helping me, the time is coming soon for me to try to do that. The "dry" periods here can be pretty unpleasant at times. Would anyone else like to comment? Perhaps some of us who'd like to could start working some PA steps.
PA 12 steps
Sounds good to me. I've been trying for awhile now to find another meeting, but haven't found any locally that I like and feel comfy with. Tried an ACOA meeting online, but the time was bad for me- like 10:30 at night. I have 2 young kids who are up at the crack of dawn and can't stay up till midnight in a meeting.
When I was using PA regularly before, there was some talk of getting an online meeting going, bu ti don't know if anything ever came of it. something to be considered for sure.